PCP life - Is a pump enough?

Adequate as long as you dont overdo it and heat the compression tube to much, as a rule 20 pumps then have a break, another 20 and so on. Takes more time but you wont get moisture. An inline filter is a good idea and will help no doubt. takes 80 odd pumps to fill a DW from 120 bar to 210 bar. AA Alfa Proj pcp pistol, takes 18-20 pumps to fill from 100bar to 200bar. Pumps are light and easy to carry around, totally self sufficient. Bottles are heavier and need filling regular. Taking a bottle with you for a long session is fine as long as you don't mind lugging a 5-7lt bottle about. Ideally a 3lt is better for that job but will require filling more often. I do also have a 3lt bottle and compressor (omega supercharger) but mostly just use the Hill mk5 pump for ease of use, quick setup and save electricity lol..
 
There seems to be a varied response here, which is good. It means that I know either way is feasible, pump, tank or compressor. I guess when the time comes, I pay my money and make my choice.

Will just have to look into the drying systems if i decide to go pump (although I guess they are relevant to compressors too). Assuming the moisture filter on say the Hatsan model is not fully adequate and not wanting to pump my pride and joy full of moist air. Does anyone have any links to what would be needed as an inline option?

Is the Dry Pack system on the Hills pumps adequate and how often do they need changing out as they don't seem to be cheap either.

Cheers
Like many others I don't believe that the dry Pac system has any value as it is left open to atmosphere even when the pump is stored and so the desiccant is compromised before you start.
It's also likely to be less efficient to try to remove the vaporised water at atmospheric pressure, rather than after it has become saturated, by the compression of the air.
I calculated that the volume of air required to raise the pressure of my 0.175 litre HW100S cylinder from 100 to 200 bar is approximately 20 litres. The volume of water likely to be stored in 20 litres of air is around 0.6 gms.
I therefore decided to install a filter in the filling whip that was capable of catching and retaining that volume of water.
I bought and use a small gold filter, that has a small tampon installed in the screw in cap. The cap is a relatively large block of metal and acts as a useful heat sink for the warm moist air entering the filter. I chill the filter before use to -18°C to encourage condensation of any water vapour. This should then be absorbed by the tampon before the colder, drier air continues on its way through the 10 - 15 grams of molecular sieve and self indicating silica beads packed into the filter body.
That volume of sieve in the filter, even at 10% absorption, should be more than enough without the tampon condensation trap.
Checking the condition of the silica beads after filling allows me to monitor the efficiency of the filtration.
The relatively slow rate of fill of a pump assists as the air moves more slowly through the filter, allowing additional exposure to the desiccant and keeping the temperature lower.

IMG_20230224_173409_947.jpg

If you want to know all of the pros and cons of the options you should use the search facility and read some of @sagalout posts on the subject.
 
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i can give you a tip with a pump. Get some money bags.. i used to fill a few money bags with 40 pellets and pump up when i finished one. This means that there was still plenty of pressure left in the gun and that it was fairly quick to pump back up to 180 bar. If you let it empty it does take some doing to pump back to full. other than that a pump is feasible. Nowa days i keep my pump as a back up. but it come in bloody handy to use while i waited for a barging tank to come along.
 
My thought process started with bottle then I got fed up driving to get it filled so bought a Hills pump then got fed up of having knackered shoulders before I even got started an bought a Wulf compressor. All three work but compressor is easiest by a million miles.
I have a bottle but the WULF compressor gets my vote too 👍
 
There seems to be a varied response here, which is good. It means that I know either way is feasible, pump, tank or compressor. I guess when the time comes, I pay my money and make my choice.

Will just have to look into the drying systems if i decide to go pump (although I guess they are relevant to compressors too). Assuming the moisture filter on say the Hatsan model is not fully adequate and not wanting to pump my pride and joy full of moist air. Does anyone have any links to what would be needed as an inline option?

Is the Dry Pack system on the Hills pumps adequate and how often do they need changing out as they don't seem to be cheap either.

Cheers

Dont need changing very often, mine is on same desiccant in dry pack since I purchased it 2 years ago. And has'nt turned blue yet. That said when I am not using it I put a bag of desiccant over the top of filter with a laggy band, stops it soaking up moisture from air when not in use 👍 .

IMG_1672.JPG
 
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Does an air gun compressor pump up car tyres as well ?
It would be possible but probably ill advised.
Car tyres are pressurised to around 2 atmospheres with a relatively large volume.
Airguns are pressurised up to 300 atmospheres with a relatively small volume.
Apart from the difficulties to be overcome in connecting the two, the output from the compressor would not be designed to provide a large volume of gas so would take a long time.
You would do better to fill a scuba tank and use that to fill the tyre via a first stage scuba regulator.
 
Like many others I don't believe that the dry Pac system has any value as it is left open to atmosphere even when the pump is stored and so the desiccant is compromised before you start.
It's also likely to be less efficient to try to remove the vaporised water at atmospheric pressure, rather than after it has become saturated, by the compression of the air.
I calculated that the volume of air required to raise the pressure of my 0.175 litre HW100S cylinder from 100 to 200 bar is approximately 20 litres. The volume of water likely to be stored in 20 litres of air is around 0.6 gms.
I therefore decided to install a filter in the filling whip that was capable of catching and retaining that volume of water.
I bought and use a small gold filter, that has a small tampon installed in the screw in cap. The cap is a relatively large block of metal and acts as a useful heat sink for the warm moist air entering the filter. I chill the filter before use to -18°C to encourage condensation of any water vapour. This should then be absorbed by the tampon before the colder, drier air continues on its way through the 10 - 15 grams of molecular sieve and self indicating silica beads packed into the filter body.
That volume of sieve in the filter, even at 10% absorption, should be more than enough without the tampon condensation trap.
Checking the condition of the silica beads after filling allows me to monitor the efficiency of the filtration.
The relatively slow rate of fill of a pump assists as the air moves more slowly through the filter, allowing additional exposure to the desiccant and keeping the temperature lower.

IMG_20230224_173409_947.jpg

If you want to know all of the pros and cons of the options you should use the search facility and read some of @sagalout posts on the subject.

Yeah, dont listen to any of us on this thread that have taken the time to reply about the pros and cons of a pump.. :ROFLMAO:
 
I only have a pump but have relatively small capacity pcp's.
The worst pump I've had oddly is the hills mk5. Although very easy to pump, it takes forever.
I've recently bought a fx pump and it has quite a bit more resistance, but fills in quarter of the time.
Maybe I just have a faulty hills pump.
lol probably faulty, same here but I got latest FX pump then changed it for a Hill lol..
 
Yeah, dont listen to any of us on this thread that have taken the time to reply about the pros and cons of a pump.. :ROFLMAO:
Sagalout is one "of us on this thread that have taken the time to reply about the pros and cons of a pump..." (See post #29)

As you can see from the following, DarrenB specifically asked about drying systems in his post and as Sagalout has posted comprehensively on the subject, I directed him to that source of information.

DarrenB
"Will just have to look into the drying systems if i decide to go pump (although I guess they are relevant to compressors too). Assuming the moisture filter on say the Hatsan model is not fully adequate and not wanting to pump my pride and joy full of moist air. Does anyone have any links to what would be needed as an inline option?

Is the Dry Pack system on the Hills pumps adequate and how often do they need changing out as they don't seem to be cheap either."

The dissemination of information is what the forum is all about so why shouldn't I make more than one source available to him?
I don't mind admitting that other members know more than me and am happy to help others to access their knowledge.
 
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This blokes going to be dizzy. Get a pump, get a cylinder, get a compressor, no get a pump. No, get a cylinder and a pump, get an hills pump, get a compressor, get a cylinder. Ffs.

There seems to be a varied response here, which is good. It means that I know either way is feasible, pump, tank or compressor. I guess when the time comes, I pay my money and make my choice.
It looks like he has realised that there is no right or wrong answer.
It will all depend upon his personal circumstances.
 
If you've only shot your springer 4 times in the garden then the chances are you'll not shoot the pcp much more so it might not be a worth while purchase considering the money involved. Maybe a pistol would be right up your street.
 
Sagalout is one "of us on this thread that have taken the time to reply about the pros and cons of a pump..." (See post #29)

As you can see from the following, DarrenB specifically asked about drying systems in his post and as Sagalout has posted comprehensively on the subject, I directed him to that source of information.

DarrenB
"Will just have to look into the drying systems if i decide to go pump (although I guess they are relevant to compressors too). Assuming the moisture filter on say the Hatsan model is not fully adequate and not wanting to pump my pride and joy full of moist air. Does anyone have any links to what would be needed as an inline option?

Is the Dry Pack system on the Hills pumps adequate and how often do they need changing out as they don't seem to be cheap either."

The dissemination of information is what the forum is all about so why shouldn't I make more than one source available to him?
I don't mind admitting that other members know more than me and am happy to help others to access their knowledge.

Easy tiger.. Just thought 'If you want to know all of the pros and cons of the options you should use the search facility and read some of @sagalout posts on the subject.' just thought it sounded tad undermining to the people who replied to his thread asking thoughts on a pump?

lol..
 
Easy tiger.. Just thought 'If you want to know all of the pros and cons of the options you should use the search facility and read some of @sagalout posts on the subject.' just thought it sounded tad undermining to the people who replied to his thread asking thoughts on a pump?

lol..
No problem!
The subject that I was referring to was the drying systems that he was asking about, rather than pumps in general.
 
Only thing I worry about using compressors/pumps is the amount of water that potentially could get into the cylinder and cause corrosion. The rusty brown crap that comes out of my two air compressors when I drain the cylinders, when I think to do it, is enough, and their a fraction on the pressure we have in our charging equipment
 
Most PCP owners share your concerns.
However installing a filter full of molecular sieve in the filling whip between the pump and the rifle appears to prevent the ingress of any water into the rifle's cylinder.
Whilst the filling pressure is significant, the volume is relatively small and most of the water contained within it can be successfully extracted.
 
Wouldn't hurt to start with a pump, I've got one for smaller cylinder guns,it's not so much fittnes but more technique I find,I'm a flyweight and I can cope,you bend your knees with straight arms and use your bodyweight on the down plunge if that makes sense,,
 
Does an air gun compressor pump up car tyres as well ?
No buddy. The pressures we are talking about means you need a small cylinder to compress low volumes. to use an airgun compressor on a car tyre would probably take all day. to put it in prospective your car tyres are 28 pounds per square inch "PSI" the average for a rifle is 200 bar thats 2900.75 psi so what you have is a low volume of air under immense pressure. A tyre is a high volume of air under low pressure.
 
That's a valid point I hadn't really thought about.

I do have options I guess if I do really get stuck. I only live about 15 mins away from Donny Indoor Range and I'm sure Brian the owner would let me use a squirt if need be. Especially once I finally get around to visiting the place again. Downside is I would have to wait until I visit to get sorted.
Also thinkning, I'm pretty sure one of my neighbours (2 or 3 doors down) has a PCP too. I've heard him in the garden shoot a rat (80% sure). So I could get chatty with him to possibly get out of a bind in future.

Cheers
Chat to him- you could go halves on a compressor. Me and a mate did just that.
 
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