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FAC and SGC Certificate Questions

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Dave1

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Hi Guys,

I'm thinking of putting in for a coterminous firearms and shotgun certificates. I know I require four referees. Does it have to be four different people to act as the referees, or can I use two people twice? Do I need Fred, Ted, Dave, and Simon, or can I just use Fred and Ted twice?
 
Always been two referees but it could have changed I guess.

What are you after ?
 
Rich79 said:
Is the fac for quarry/vermin or are you in a club?
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FAC requires you to demonstrate a need to hold one such as club membership (target shooting) or suitable land permission or ownership (for vermin control). SGC is a right unless the rozzers can prove you arent a suitable person ( criminal, mental or medical reasons)
 
smartshooting said:
FAC requires you to demonstrate a need to hold one such as club membership (target shooting) or suitable land permission or ownership (for vermin control). SGC is a right unless the rozzers can prove you arent a suitable person ( criminal, mental or medical reasons)
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For club fac one reference has to be a club official that's why I'm asking.
 
Rich79 said:
For club fac one reference has to be a club official that's why I'm asking.
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The referee needs to have known you for at least 2 years.

You could be a full member of a Home Office approved club, and every club official might only know you for the 6 months you have been through probation.

No need for a club official to be one of your referees, but the club will have to confirm that you are a full member, and are a regular attendee. (At least your 3 visits a year after becoming a full member.)

Obviously that is if target shooting is your good reason.
 
2506sendero said:
I always thought that club officials were not permitted to act as referees Rich, has it changed?
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It's always been that way as far as I know, and I've been in a club over 25yrs!
It's normally someone higher up on committee level but they all have to know you still.
Eg I couldn't ask anybody if they don't shoot the same disciplines on the same ranges and I'm just a fellow member they've never met.
 
the only thing that i know that has actually changed over the last few years is to bring SGC application/renewal in line with FAC in as much as you now need 2 referees to apply for both up from one just for SGC.
 
Having the club secretary (or other club official) be a referee is no longer required, even if the only use is target shooting. I seem to remember in the past this may have been a requirement, but not for some time. The club will be contacted separately to verify your membership status. 2x referees need to be listed as character references. A club official who you may not have met, or may not have known for 2 years does not count towards this. If however you are good mates with your club secretary and have known them for >2 years, then there is nothing stopping them from being one of your referees.

Below is from the Durham website, but the Met and other forces also have the same guidance published.


I don’t really know them. I am the secretary of the shooting club that they are a member of. Can I still be a referee for them?​

No. As explained above, the referee must be able to comment on the applicant’s character and give opinion on their suitability and, for that reason, the referee must know them, rather than just being able to comment on their club membership status.

In circumstances where the application is for a firearm certificate and the applicant’s stated good reason for the firearm is for target shooting, the police will contact a principal officer (usually the police liaison officer or secretary) of the approved rifle or muzzle loading pistol club which was specified in the application. The purpose is to confirm that the applicant is a member; the regularity of their attendance; their shooting discipline being of an acceptable standard; and how they are complying with club rules and safety procedures related to their shooting.

This is not placing that individual as a referee.
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Rich79 said:
For club fac one reference has to be a club official that's why I'm asking.
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Not any more.
The referee has to be: "a resident of Great Britain, of good character, have known you personally for at least two years, and not be related to you or a serving police officer". That's the only criteria.

The referees can be a club official but the FLD will speak to the club anyway and the two referees are there to show you 'have a life' and not just some sad loner with a gun fetish.

After one tragedy it was found the holder's referees were a Dr who really didn't now the applicant socially, and a club official who only ever saw the applicant at a club night on best behaviour. Neither referee knew them personally or socially.
 
Sarge said:
After one tragedy it was found the holder's referees were a Dr who really didn't now the applicant socially, and a club official who only ever saw the applicant at a club night on best behaviour. Neither referee knew them personally or socially.
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Indeed, when i applied for my first ticket in 1988, the list for people that were deemed as "suitable" to sign your application was a lot shorter - Doctor & Magistrate springs to mind.
 
2506sendero said:
Indeed, when i applied for my first ticket in 1988, the list for people that were deemed as "suitable" to sign your application was a lot shorter - Doctor & Magistrate springs to mind.
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I seem to remember you could use a professional; lawyer, your manager, and a local farmer/land-owner were also included, the first two were dodgy, and I was related to the third.
 
When my boy applied for his FAC (Coterminous), one of his referees was his Boss. Told by Firearms to get another 😱
 
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