DIANA MODEL 10 WHY OH WHY

[marflow]

many of you know i own way too many Giss System pistons and i have 4 model 10s
a month or so i took a honker apart that had been rebuilt and i had to do the whole thing over never cleaned and had red seal and some will know a hate those damn red front seals
i was bored and need to do something so i grabbed another model 10 to take a look and what i found was not good never cleaned right and i hadn't even got it apart, so at least i was going to reclean and relube and see what the hell and what the hell i found was a pain
anyone that knows these pistols know there is a spring guide that sets in the pistons but normally stuck and most people just leave them stuck, now hold on the that thought
in the piston there 2 opposing holes but are cover with the spring guide
now the pistol came apart okay the cocking part was very tight, normally they will slim out
now the front piston, stuck solid, put a punch through the barrel pivot hole and connected the linkage with and small screwdriver and push the barrel down and what did i get HONK, $%#@$, now i had to push forward that was a pain soaked it with Break Free it was dripping
back and forth, back and forth and at one point the spring guide fell out, back and forth more times than i what to say
was going to stuff it a box because it had made me cranky
but thought what could a make a puller out of, remember those holes in the pistons, heavy coat hanger was fashioned
sear was held out of the way coat hanger found its holes, hang in the vice and a hard pull and the piston was on the floor
it was filth, it was half off the piston and the fact that the spring guide fell out saved my bacon
the red seals are a problem are all red seals the same who knows but a blue seal will never do this
this is a story learn from it but i will leave one last though that is have said before
you cannot clean these pistols enough and to stop when it is still dirty is like putting 15 years of wear on the pistol and is you sent it out and the smith did this he is not a smith
this pistol had been rebuilt before i bought it i would have factored that into the price i paid
a bad rebuild is like it has been done
rear seal is fine the stepped washer was wrong that will be change the springs look fine as if the small inner springs are long than the outer
now did the seal come loose when the pistol was being used or did it come loose as i pulled it out either way it shoudl never happen the seal for these are next level hard to install i think is was so tight it was pulled loose but will never know
you see the filth on the seal and piston head the tube is the same
a couple picture and the post is done

 

[Ian Cartmell]

I've had a few 10/6/6m etc and had nowt but trouble with most.

They all shot too high or too low and ran out of clicks.

Always shot to the right and ran out adjustment.

The rifles 65/66/75 have thankfully behaved but it's put me off Giss guns for life.

 

[mickson]

I've had a few 10/6/6m etc and had nowt but trouble with most.

They all shot too high or too low and ran out of clicks.

Always shot to the right and ran out adjustment.

The rifles 65/66/75 have thankfully behaved but it's put me off Giss guns for life.

I've had a 6m for over 30 yrs no problems shoots great just basic service twice. Great accurate pistol for me.

 

[Sgibbar]

Another epic journey ! I have re built a couple of these and on one it cocked and fired but no air, when I stripped it down I found the piston seal wedged into the front of the chamber but not on the piston? It looked new and I thought I would fit it and see if it came off again. It didn’t, I can only think that the person who did it gave up, chucked the seal in and thought that in firing it the piston would “install” itself . It didn’t so they sold it at auction.
Well done, another saved.

 

[marflow]

i think my main point beside the trouble is people are rebuilding these and are doing a poor job of course i am in the states
so, if the ad says has been rebuilt that fact could be worthless
to shove an oversize seal down the tube that was not even cleaned up till the metal shined is not a rebuild it is a hack job
now on the shooting, up down, left right
i have read many posts on the elevation problem and that is why Diana used shims to help that i have seen from 0 to 4
now windage is a new problem and would be much harder to fix
are the Giss System pistols the best, maybe not but if you have one that works they are great fun

there is an old adage
IF YOU WANT IT DONE RIGHT DO IT YOURSELF and with 2 model 10's i have found that to be true but i have a 4th to inspect maybe next week

 

[Drage1991]

Sorry to revive a dead thread, but figured it would be more relevant to ask here rather than start a new one.

I've got a Diana model 10, and the point of impact is high. I've completely run out of adjustment on the rear right and it's in it's furthest back position. Theres probably less than 1mm space between the hand guard on the front of the pistol and the front post. I don't suppose you have any suggestions as to what might be causing the issue?

 

[Sgibbar]

Sorry to revive a dead thread, but figured it would be more relevant to ask here rather than start a new one.

I've got a Diana model 10, and the point of impact is high. I've completely run out of adjustment on the rear right and it's in it's furthest back position. Theres probably less than 1mm space between the hand guard on the front of the pistol and the front post. I don't suppose you have any suggestions as to what might be causing the issue?

Replace the breech washer, they are not meant to make metal to metal contact, you can also add shims behind the seal to hold it further out for more adjustment, Diana, supplied the pistols with metal ones but you can make them Out of anything stable (like plastic milk bottle)

 

[marflow]

so this is a weak point with the 5-6-10
the O-ring is your adjustment, kind of stupid
so are all O-rings of the same size the same size NO
so Diana came up with the slim adjustment method i have seen as many as zero to 4
the shims are 0.10mm not much but enough to make a difference
now you need to shim it and they are at Knibbs but they are out
so what to do, do you floss if so, go get some Dental floss and make a few loops and put behind the O-ring and test need more you know what to do
easy quick fix

 

[Drage1991]

Cheers for the answers gentlemen. I will enact the dental floss method and see what occurs. I'm tempted to break out some calipers and see if I can't 3d print some shims, but I don't know if I've got nozzles small enough to print something like that. I'll report back either way! Thanks again

 

[MrLuftArtisan]

Cheers for the answers gentlemen. I will enact the dental floss method and see what occurs. I'm tempted to break out some calipers and see if I can't 3d print some shims, but I don't know if I've got nozzles small enough to print something like that. I'll report back either way! Thanks again

making a mountain from a molehill with 3d printed shims
cut plastic or even thin sheet metal like brass.

 

[marflow]

so making your own
first find some 0.10 mm material that is just a little more than printer paper
can you cut that out without distorting it
so, the dental floss is a test will it work and if so fine, is it factory hell no but it is the solution that has been mentioned here in the states for 20 years
i am trying to point out a quick test use or don't i really don't care

 

[mike8]

I just got a model 10 today. A bit rusted! Does anyone know what finish they used?

Mine had 3,5 spacers under the oring. Because they cut all these grooves a bit canted i think, so they needed to compensate that out with half a spacer.

Oh yeah that pastic part up front is no longer in one piece btw

 

[Ian Cartmell]

I just got a model 10 today. A bit rusted! Does anyone know what finish they used?

Mine had 3,5 spacers under the oring. Because they cut all these grooves a bit canted i think, so they needed to compensate that out with half a spacer.

Oh yeah that pastic part up front is no longer in one piece btw

View attachment 1019794View attachment 1019795View attachment 1019796

Parkerized I believe

 

[marflow]

another crime scene the FWB 600 and now a model 10
so i will be blunt i ama bet of an export on the model 10
now this is a whole different kettle of fish
the piston set and how it works is not want most guns are
so you need some bags each area goes in the bags
front sight barrel stuff you get the point
now the outside Lan is correct to my knowledge
so you could have a hard time getting this pistol apart and i would say never take more of the trigger parts out then you need
message me
take the barrel off leave together, grips off, trigger guard off and stop with the trigger guard off the thin cover should come off and that being thin is going to be a problem to tube is a real mess and the small parts like spring and such
if you were here in the states i would say send it to me get that done and message me

 

[marflow]

the gut of the model 10 will be okay but getting the front piton out could be a real problem
many people take the complete trigger apart but when you get in there you will see the working room is small
now with the grips off you will find that the grips saved what is under them MAYBE
the rear piston is not a problem it will come out easy the round cover in the back is plastic the cap will be a pain to clean again i have done a few
there is a sear that prevents the front piston to pass and come out but instead of take all the parts out you can take a small screwdriver or something and push out of the way
now here is another problem the front piston can get stuck in the tube there are two hole in the piston and s simple strong coat hanger can be made as a tool to pull in out
now the RUB each pistol has a female spring guide and the hollow tube covers the 2 hole that could be used to pull the piston out
i had such a gun and i was lucky the guide came loose but some i have had even after socking and have on a table in front of me fought me tooth and nail
now these are just the starting point getting apart and cleaning and refinishing we still have to get the parts and rebuild the pistol

 

[mike8]

I took my 6 g t01 apart. But it was basically unused. No need to do anything or change anything except from the sjitty target grips with tolerances so wide it was almost unbelivable how sjitty it was.

Now this gun looked bad in thd pics. But the pics were so bad so its basically sight unseen.
I took it half apart. Figured out how it works.

Now my goal is to completely strip it and refinish it. Then put in new parts if needed. But this one will probably need new parts. Springs looked unrusted though.

 

[marflow]

the guts have grease, grease will not rust
the model 6 has the, the same trigger as the 5
the model 10 has a completely different assembly
well i see you will be fine the pistol is in very bad shape but good luck

 

[Drage1991]

I'll definitely be using the dental floss technique to start with that's for sure. The 3d printing option was more a down the road solution, and only because ei have the printer and it seems like something simple to start with in terms of trying to make a 3d object

 

[marflow]

3D printing could work but we are talking 0.10 mm that is paper plus in thickness
i have always thought of using punches to make them but they would just ball up at that thickness
you see when i got onto this i bought all sorts of parts to have so spares were not a problem but idea of making them always crossed my mind
the shims are very fragile in the first place but if it works that is what counts