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HW100 Burst disk ?

Mr Fettler

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I've had problems with my HW100, leaking seals etc, so I've striped the front end, removed the belleville washers, inspecting as I go.
In the screw plug for the regulator is a white plastic plate (part No:2671 - is this a burst seal ?, mine has a crack around the edge so obviously needs replacing, so not something I can knock up in the workshop.
I've also noticed that the pellet probe has slightly had the black coating polished away from one side so something must be touching, so looks like a rear end strip as well.
Nick
 
No, this is just a disc to keep dust and crap out of the belleville stack. If air is escaping here then it will be the o-rings on the regulator piston

Your gun will have a burst seal, 99% of the time it's built into the air gauge.
 
Loads of places an HW100 can leak.

Does it leak down the barrel? if so knock of valve not seating, remove the breach plate and inspect the seat should be clean bare alloy usually you'll see a ring of dirt you can remove with scotch brite, inspect valve face itself.

Is it leaking from breach plate? There's a bose the o ring locates on, if this has been removed a few times the o ring can get pinched / squashed and no longer seals.

Leaking around where the cylinder screws in? replace the o ring on the brass body the other side of the regulator.

leaking out of the little breather holes? Either end plug seals or the breather hole nearest the gauge will the o ring behind the gauge, if this is the case go careful this the most difficult one to replace as you have to wind the gauge out which is £80+ if you need to replace it.

Leaking from the fill port? Difficult to detect if only a slight leak. You need a large flat headed screw driver and replace to o ring on the little brass wheel. Sometimes people loose the wheel or remove it to get more life out of the o ring!

There's the test port at the bottom but never had these leak, there's always a first time.

I think that's it for leaks you can detect externally.

A seal kit is about £14 just go through it methodically, take note of how it comes apart and which way round this go.

Good luck (y)
 
The guy is above is bang on. Honestly once one o-ring starts to go brittle and leak the rest won't be far behind it.

Do them all, use a bit of grease on them and clean everything methodically. It will serve you well for years to come.
 
It was entirely MY own fault, bought a lane regulator off here set at 94 bar, installed it, bypassed the fitted belleville regulator, attached the test pressure gauge to the gun, attached the cylinder and instead of getting 94 bar, it tool the whole lot, luckily I had only filled it to 150bar not 200. Didn't realise I had caused a problem until I took a first shot at the range, I could hear the difference.
So I knew it needed a new breech seal +++. On inspection I've found a few problems, the ali plate with the angled seat that keeps the air in the plentium looks like it was machined with a brick, honestly using a glass it looks like a record with all the grooves.
I've also found an o-ring that was obviously pinched during the build.
Not the quality I was led to believe when buying a Weihrauch, but It gives me something to fettle with, learning as I go.
 
BTW, the rifle was new 6 months ago, so old perished & hardened o-rings shouldn't be a thing, but it is.
 
It was entirely MY own fault, bought a lane regulator off here set at 94 bar, installed it, bypassed the fitted belleville regulator, attached the test pressure gauge to the gun, attached the cylinder and instead of getting 94 bar, it tool the whole lot, luckily I had only filled it to 150bar not 200. Didn't realise I had caused a problem until I took a first shot at the range, I could hear the difference.
So I knew it needed a new breech seal +++. On inspection I've found a few problems, the ali plate with the angled seat that keeps the air in the plentium looks like it was machined with a brick, honestly using a glass it looks like a record with all the grooves.
I've also found an o-ring that was obviously pinched during the build.
Not the quality I was led to believe when buying a Weihrauch, but It gives me something to fettle with, learning as I go.

Hi, lots of things to cover here buddy.

Firstly, the Lane regulator is an effective upgrade as long as other things are changed to ensure the best performance consistency and efficiency wise. The best option is to fit it in an altered cylinder end which is bored out to 22mm diameter and 22mm depth. Prechamber size is of paramount importance or the regulator won’t always fully equalise. If you’ve left the old insides in place and just removed the ball bearing from inside the inlet/regulator valve then you’ll need to back out the regulator adjuster sufficiently. I don’t know the exact distance as I’ve replaced the whole regulator assembly in ours, you’ll have to experiment. You can get replacement prechambers, but you’ll need to restrict the volume to about 25% of its original size. Leave the valve size as it was from the factory. My lads 20 carbine with a Lane intube regulator does about eight mags with a spread of 8fps with pellets out of the tin. Use a Lane five bar test to establish the most appropriate regulator setting.

The factory regulators are actually very good, as long as they’re set up correctly and you don’t overfill the cylinder. Aftermarket regulators just allow higher fill pressures and increased shot count.

Leak wise, some of it has been covered. So let’s deal with the inlet/regulator valve first, if either of those O rings (outside and inside) have failed then you’ll experience a leak through the breath hole that’s situated at the front of the block. O ring between inlet/regulator valve and block will also cause a leak through this vent hole. The regulator sleeve and regulator piston O rings will leak out of the stock screw hole or regulator adjuster. The Belleville washers are only exposed to atmosphere, the white blanking plug just keeps dust out. If the valve block O ring fails then you’ll get a leak out of the block where the two parts join. If the valve isn’t sealing then you’ll get a leak down the barrel with the side lever closed. The original valve block O rings from the factory are oversized and crush fit 12 x 1.2mm, this is unnecessary and should be replaced with a 12 x 1mm.

Regarding the valve, the seat on the valve blocks can sometimes lightly mark, this can be overcome by polishing the valve seat uniformly. To do this I use a piece of Delrin I’ve machined to the same angle as the seat, I put steristrip around the end then use Autosol to polish it. I then polish the valve by adding another small smear of Autosol and running the valve in the valve block seat. I’m sure HW100 Tuning did a video of this. I use a pillar drill to do this. Don’t overdo it, it only needs a quick polish. Once finished clean everything thoroughly with isopropyl alcohol or brake cleaner.

Cylinder end leaks are generally down to poor filling practice, I’ve completed a cylinder repair stickie in the tech section.


Cylinder leaks can be fixed in virtually every situation by replacing the cylinder fill end O ring (26 x 2mm) and the valve O ring (3.15 x 1.8mm). Don’t attempt to replace the gauge O ring unless you have a means of removing the glass prior to unscrewing the gauge or the likelihood is you’ll break the face off it. Leaks from this location are very rare in any case, so replacing it as a matter of course is unnecessary.

The breech seal is only active during the firing cycle and a worn one can be detected as you’ll get a loud crack at the breech when you fire the gun, likewise you can put a tissue over the breech and it’ll get blown off when you fire the gun.

I hope this helps.

BM

IMG_1369.webp
IMG_1370.webp
 
New 6 months ago and you are already fitting a Lane reg!
Yes, it would keep giving me flyers, must have tried x10 different pellets, makes, weights and sizes, leaded, cleaned, oiled etc.
Bought an external Huma reg to be used in tether mode so cylinder at a constant 130bar, still flyers,
Read that the sprung regs are far superior to the washer type, hence the Lane reg but couldn't get it working.
Chrono told me the power was going up and down, zero consistency from one shot to another.
Thing is, as a plinker its great, but I bought this gun to enter future competitions, maybe I was expecting too much ??.
Nick
 
Hi, lots of things to cover here buddy.
Firstly, thank you SO much for taking the time to respond, a few quick points
the cylinders (x2) are air tight, I bought a titanium one and fitted Fenton ends to give me something to play with without touching the original.

Yes I left the internals in the gun while testing my plan, I have the HW100 insert but until I get the Lane working I won't be removing the std setup, last time I tried it (Lane reg) I had it opened the minimum 0.25mm (60 bar? ) and still it just dumps in the entire pressure of the cylinder so I will be looking at sending it back to Mr Lane for a service and a reset.

Regarding the block, its terrible with actual gouges, so bad in fact I was considering boring it out, fitting an insert and machining the angle back in to it. I was planning on possibly using the CMM machine in work, to work out the actual angle unless you know what it is.

As for the 5 bar test, I removed the Lane, bypassed the internal reg, and used the external Huma reg, shooting 3 pellets at a time, increasing 5 bar at a time, plotting the results. It was at this point I gave up, as I could hear a leak and the chrono graph started to go all over the place. Maybe I should have spent more time inspecting, but I have all the o=rings and just jumped in, and very happy that I did, learnt a lot so far.
Nick

BTW, totally correct on the block valve o-ring being oversized and crushed, not sure what size HW100 have supplied me with so will get the calipers out.

.
 
Yes, it would keep giving me flyers, must have tried x10 different pellets, makes, weights and sizes, leaded, cleaned, oiled etc.
Bought an external Huma reg to be used in tether mode so cylinder at a constant 130bar, still flyers,
Read that the sprung regs are far superior to the washer type, hence the Lane reg but couldn't get it working.
Chrono told me the power was going up and down, zero consistency from one shot to another.
Thing is, as a plinker its great, but I bought this gun to enter future competitions, maybe I was expecting too much ??.
Nick

The regs are set too high from the factory, about 93 bar for a 177 full length and 96 for a 177 carbine. If you change the reg it can be different to that. The recommended reg setting for my HW100 full length in 20 is 85-88 bar, when carrying out a five bar test with the Lane reg, from recollection the optimum setting was 82 bar.

Inconsistency is often down to grease on the hammer assembly, hammer tension too high and regulator setting.
 
Mine is full length, .177 sub 12, and before I started messing the reg pressure was a constant 94 bar, and yes it took a good few seconds to refill back to 94 but it was VERY consistent. (so much for HW regs being crap, more internet BS ??)
I have a new hammer assembly (rear only) without the anti tamper but I've not been in there yet.
One problem at a time I was taught.
 
Mine is full length, .177 sub 12, and before I started messing the reg pressure was a constant 94 bar, and yes it took a good few seconds to refill back to 94 but it was VERY consistent. (so much for HW regs being crap, more internet BS ??)
I have a new hammer assembly (rear only) without the anti tamper but I've not been in there yet.
One problem at a time I was taught.

Hi buddy, the optimum setting for your model is 91-94 bar, you can actually test this without a reg gauge, as long as you have a chrono. As long as your hammer tension isn’t too high, keep adjusting the regulator pressure until the velocity peaks. Back the hammer tension off until the velocity drops then adjust the reg. Hypothetically if it’s doing 690fps at 91 bar, 695 at 93 and 690 at 95 your optimum setting will be around 93 bar, where it’s most consistent and efficient.
 
Yes I left the internals in the gun while testing my plan, I have the HW100 insert but until I get the Lane working I won't be removing the std setup, last time I tried it (Lane reg) I had it opened the minimum 0.25mm (60 bar? ) and still it just dumps in the entire pressure of the cylinder so I will be looking at sending it back to Mr Lane for a service and a reset.



.
Bit dim here but was the HW cylinder 'exhaust' valve still in place please?
 
Bit dim here but was the HW cylinder 'exhaust' valve still in place please?
No question is dim, its how we learn and I will ask questions.
by exhaust valve in cylinder if you mean where the air comes out of - YES it was left in place so a charged cylinder could be removed still full.
If I haven't understood your question please let me know, only too happy to help if I can.
 
Some of us are born lucky. My HW100 has done over 3 years with no leaks and pumps out over100 shots at a consistent 11.2 ft lbs with medium weight pellets. And when the evil day of a leak occurs, I will not hesitate to pop down the road just 2 miles from the range and deliver the gun into the hands of the expert at AG&T.
 
After reading this thread I thought that I should start making plans for the day that my HW100S develops a leak. It is now 15 years old and I've owned it for the last ten of those. I try and use it often enough to stop it dying of neglect, but I have a '77 and a 50 which need exercising too!
Since purchasing it I've had to dismantle the rear block to remove the hammer and lose the anti-tamper kit. I bought various seal kits, a regulator pressure gauge and a few other minor bits and pieces from HW100 Tuning.

Andy, aka @Blackmax has been very generous with his knowledge and experience and his posts are always worth reading. I recently followed his leaking cylinder "sticky" to replace the inlet valve and end cap O rings to cure a slow leak on mine. Until very recently I had thought that when it needed resealing I would probably try and get it to Blackmax for a rebuild, despite the distance between Surrey and Norfolk.
I would rather not put the complete rifle in the hands of a courier company once, and twice is even worse!

However, another member recently recommended a couple of HW100 rebuild videos by Sub 12 Airgunners on YouTube. He had been in a similar position to me but watching the videos left him confident enough to have a go. It proved to be successful and inspired me to watch them and in due course I intend to have a go too!
 
No question is dim, its how we learn and I will ask questions.
by exhaust valve in cylinder if you mean where the air comes out of - YES it was left in place so a charged cylinder could be removed still full.
If I haven't understood your question please let me know, only too happy to help if I can.
Sorry for delayed reaction. Asked 'cos puzzled by you comment of Lane reg. dumping contents of cylinder #10.
Can only dump contents, for me, if there's a leak from the HW reg. block/knock open valve
 
Can only dump contents, for me, if there's a leak from the HW reg. block/knock open valve
As a recap, I put the lane reg in the cylinder and took out the ball and spring in the 100, this apparently disables the standard regulator meaning that the Lane one now controls the available pressure, which it didn't, so what ever pressure in BAR is in the cylinder now goes straight in to the rifle, so when I connected a pressure gauge, instead of having 94 BAR I was reading 150 BAR which split the burst disk.

New disks arrived yesterday, I have a complete set of O-rings so today will be a strip and rebuild taking it all back to standard HW settings but adjusting the reg down to 91 BAR as recommended by Blackmax.

I need to pull my finger out, contact Mr Lane and send the reg back to get his opinion.
 
Here's my solution, thread the DIN filler M6x1 to accept the standard reg pressure gauge, perfect. :giggle:
.. there are NO burst discs in a HW100 !!
20260419_180416.webp20260419_180338.webp
 
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