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Hunting & Conscience? .

Fox Tales said:
I struggle with the application of human traits to animals as well , anamorphic labels are a nonsense . It's nature !

Foxes do seem to divide .

But I disagree with some of your observations to a degree . Fox behaviour is more akin to a cats , they share many traits . They will play with their food , hiss and spit as cubs and kill for the sake of it . They also share a lot of physical attributes, including being able to turn their ears and have retractable claws .
They are intelligent creatures with an appealing appearance and like any animal , they should be given respect .

For some reason I've found some people have respect for the quarry they shoot based on size . A deer would be given more respect than a squirrel , I've yet to understand why ?
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Yup agreed that in many ways they are closer to cats. They certainly aren't pack animals like dogs.

Didnt know they had retractable claws- interesting! 😀

Totally agree on the size = respect thing. Im guilty of it too in truth. Both in hunting and my domestic food choices.

There's a certain amount of relatability to it I think. Vaguely human sized animals are easier to relate to- and we assume larger = more intelligent too maybe ?
 
mightymouse1066 said:
I didnt ask that because its irrelevant.
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Well you seem to be the first Nihilist Anti I have met in the hunting section.

mightymouse1066 said:
You're still doing it. You're viewing wild animals by human standards.
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I don't think I am, I was just trying to understand what you expect from a fox.

Your viewpoint seems to suggest, we should not interfere with nature, let it take its course.
Not "a believer" then, Genesis 1:26 not your sort of thing, that's fine, but unless we wish to give up the planet to chaos (perhaps that is your bag) we have to control some things, remove weeds, reduce pest loads, vermin, or is that too anthropomorphic?

I assume you don't have bleach, or other cleaning products in your house, brush your teeth or anything else that might reduce the wildlife around you?
Are you a believer in Jainism?
Or is your outrage selective, mass based, some sliding scale based on edibility, furriness, resistance to domestication?




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OldStock said:
Well you seem to be the first Nihilist Anti I have met in the hunting section.



I don't think I am, I was just trying to understand what you expect from a fox.

Your viewpoint seems to suggest, we should not interfere with nature, let it take its course.
Not "a believer" then, Genesis 1:26 not your sort of thing, that's fine, but unless we wish to give up the planet to chaos (perhaps that is your bag) we have to control some things, remove weeds, reduce pest loads, vermin, or is that too anthropomorphic?

I assume you don't have bleach, or other cleaning products in your house, brush your teeth or anything else that might reduce the wildlife around you?
Are you a believer in Jainism?
Or is your outrage selective, mass based, some sliding scale based on edibility, furriness, resistance to domestication?
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I expect a fox to behave as its nature and genetics dictate. And i make no moral judgement on its actions either way.

I didnt say we shouldn't control pests.

I have no outrage.

You really should read posts more than once before responding 😀
 
mightymouse1066 said:
A natural drive to kill everything is just that- natural- for them. The classic situation whereby they do this in a seemingly cruel/uneccassary way (by human standards)- a fox in the hen house- is created by humans. A load of overweight inbred chickens restricted in a space isn't a natural situation. No wonder a fox goes crazy. Such behaviour clearly has evolutionary benefits- because nature did it.
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I don’t think “natural” automatically puts something beyond reflection or critique. We’re part of nature too. The difference is, we’re animals with self-awareness—able to question our impulses, imagine consequences, and make ethical choices. Looking at the world through human eyes isn’t some distortion of nature; it’s part of what nature produced.

A fox follows its instincts. Fair enough. But we evolved the ability to reflect on ours—to ask not just what we can do, but whether we should. That’s not stepping outside nature. That is our nature.

If a fox had our level of dominance—our tools, our reach, our ability to reshape entire ecosystems—it wouldn’t remain some innocent force of instinct. It would do what we’ve done: shape the world in its favour. And that, too, would be natural.

But calling something natural doesn’t make it good, or wise, or just. Nature’s full of behaviours that are brutal, chaotic, or destructive. What matters is what we choose to do with the power it gave us.
 
The one & only thing that separates human hunting from animal hunting is empathy, we alone possess the ability to empathize with our prey, we both evolved hunting to survive, the difference is we, as humans, can make a conscious decision whether or not to pull the trigger, loose the arrow, or just walk away...
 
chouchin66 said:
Quite the opposite, actually. Myself , a hunter, I have a clearer conscience - giving an an animal a humane dispatch, after it's had a "cage free" life & reaping the benifits of non stressed existance. Hormone injected meat produced from factory farming is stressed, sometimes ill treated, & merely a commodity. Harvesting your own meat - nope, no question, a clear conscience here.
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Hi Chris, the same here, i have been hunting/ shooting since a young boy,
i was born on a farm out in the sticks so shooting comes
easy on me,hunting from 8yrs old pest control
but with a lot of prey thats edible it has to be done,
pests need culling but in a humane manner,
and thats the goal of us all.!!!!!!
atb brian
 
There’s a mix of feelings on all this. I don’t like killing things, but I do want to eat meat and we have a LOT of rats round here.

I’ve shot rats round the place and we’ve now got a lot of rabbits, and I do like rabbit to eat, so I think they’re next. Not sure how I’ll feel about it. But then I’ve raised pigs and sheep and sent them to slaughter, then done some butchery when I get them back. So this is kind of the same I think

I hate sending the animals off to the abattoir and apologise to them before they go. But I’ve given them the best life I can. It’s a bit conflicting to eat and animal you gave belly rubs to, but I think better that way that something that was treated badly. Wild animals are somewhere in the middle with that - they’re not treated well or badly.

I don’t kill flies or wasps because I don’t see any reason to do that
 
The end of life for a farm animal is not ideal , coralling an animal into the back of a truck and driving it halfway across the country for slaughter . It just feels all wrong , but the masses need to be fed and efficency is key when high volumes are involved .

There's a YouTuber , I believe his name is "Oz the home kill guy " or something along those lines . He travels around NZ with his butchery van , his slaughtering method relies on cattle being naturally curious . When they get near he headshoots them with a 22 lr subsonic . Quick , humane and low stress , an altogether more respectful end of life .
 
Shooting/hunting has been in my family for generations so it's second nature to me,i also depend on it for food,i live on game meat,i know nothing better,killing doesn't phase me but the only kick i get out of killing is the recoil,i will not kill anything that doesn't require killing whether that be for food or vermin control,although i kill i cannot abide animal cruelty,some folk cannot get their head around that one.
 
I honestly think that it is an age thing, my late father went that way in his 60s and now I am in my late 60s I feel the same.
Do I really need to kill,
It was a necessity in our time for food as we ate everything, but now I really appreciate life.
 
My motto has always been simple
I hunt for food and yes if I’ve shot it I’m eating it.
I kill for pest control when appropriately needed
And remorse no I respect life I don’t kill for no reason and I’ve actually spoken with vegetarians that have said they have no issue with my hunting etc as they know I eat what I hunt etc.
 
Ganton Gunner said:
My motto has always been simple
I hunt for food and yes if I’ve shot it I’m eating it.
I kill for pest control when appropriately needed
And remorse no I respect life I don’t kill for no reason and I’ve actually spoken with vegetarians that have said they have no issue with my hunting etc as they know I eat what I hunt etc.
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Can You send em to me? I’ll do you a swap for the ones around here that can’t/wont understand it!
 
keithy said:
Regarding most quarry a shot through the head is far better than bring ripped apart by a dog/ fox or Bird of prey. I bet not many die of old age.
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just a point head shots are a bad idea

watch your dog laid on the ground - body is still but head moves all the time watching the world

i have seen the results of head shots - jaw blown off and animal still alive

never ever head shots please - even down to rats the jaw can be blown off

and from experience i followed a hind for three miles with her jaw hanging off - something i never wish to ever see again

i admit to taking a head shot on a friends farm in Aus for a salty attacking cattle - only place to kill the buggers quickly and its a big steady target

heart/lung shot on a croc in water is impossible
 
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morning star said:
just a point head shots are a bad idea

watch your dog laid on the ground - body is still but head moves all the time watching the world

i have seen the results of head shots - jaw blown off and animal still alive

never ever head shots please - even down to rats the jaw can be blown off

and from experience i followed a hind for three miles with her jaw hanging off - something i never wish to ever see again

i admit to taking a head shot on a friends farm in Aus for a salty attacking cattle - only place to kill the buggers quickly and its a big steady target

heart/lung shot on a croc in water is impossible
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